[mitsubishi]

Pay attention to this because I'm certain about it: There is no widespread climate of people wanting to know how the code works internally. They just want to know how things will work on a high level when it is released. They don't want to know anything more than what anyone will know after it's released by just using it.

*Does anyone remember posts here asking for internal code? If there are a few I'm sure they are a tiny minority.

This post has been edited by mitsubishi: 10 July 2010 - 01:25 PM

[s.e.t.i.]

mitsubishi, on 10 July 2010 - 01:13 PM, said:

Pay attention to this because I'm certain about it: I don't remember a widespread climate of wanting to know how it works internally. They just want to know how things will work when it is released. They don't want to know anything more than what anyone would know after it's released by just using it.

Who are you to tell me, or any of us, to pay attention? You might consider changing your tone just a bit. You sound irritated and you're giving me the impression that you have expectations of how open you think we should be and you feel somewhat justified in telling me or us how to run things here. I can appreciate the anticipation people have with the major changes that are forthcoming. I had the very same questions when I wasn't part of the development team and process. The difference between us is that I settled for knowing SID/FS would let me know what I need when they were ready. There really is no other scenario to consider.

If we are holding back it's because we have very specific reasons for doing so. FrozenSand is a team and we aim to preserve the Intellectual Property that we are developing. We will have updates and explanations for everything when the time is right to do so and not before. We are following sound business practices like any good business team should.

[mitsubishi]

It didn't say pay attention to release information, I said pay attention because you seem to think a large number of players want to release the code of the AC which isn't the case.

[Shminkyboy]

mitsubishi.

We appreciate your concern. We have it under control. Thanks for the heads up =)


We don't like to get into arguments with the community about what should be open and what should be closed about our game. We are fully aware of the different views within different factions of the community concerning the openness or closedness of our development. It is entirely prudent and within our rights as a development team to protect our intellectual property, and choices about open/closed development are solely our choice to make. Frankly, pubic debates about it are actually kind of irrelevent.

Again, thanks for your concern, we've got a plan. Good Day.

[s.e.t.i.]

mitsubishi, on 10 July 2010 - 02:27 PM, said:

It didn't say pay attention to release information, I said pay attention because you seem to think a large number of players want to release the code of the AC which isn't the case.

We give everything we read its due attention. I honestly don't care if anybody wants us to release code, there's only really one that I can think of that thinks we should... and that is the very least of our worries, trust me. However, I did not think that was what you meant and I'm not going to second guess or play games.

For reasons of protecting our intellectual property, we will NOT release any more information on the functionality of Passport or its relationship to the Anticheat that has been developed. This is for our own protection and ultimately YOURS [the community].

I will say that we are very close to coming to an end of two long years of new development, bug fixes, maps and engine upgrades. So please sit tight for a just little while longer. Thanks :)

[Kendle]

For what it's worth I don't give a XXXX how the A/C or Passport actually works, and I'm sure Mitsu was just making the point that pretty much no-one else does either. You're keen to protect your IP, understandably, but as Mitsu was saying no-one's asking HOW the A/C works, they just want to know WHAT it does.

Earlier in this thread Frankie was talking about how the A/C / Passport wasn't about banning people, and about how it would simply kick a cheater on detection, and then kick them again if they cheated again (implying they could play again after being caught the first time).

Most server operators and leagues operate ban lists, whereby you're not prevented from playing today because you cheated today, you're banned from playing today because you cheated some time in the past, which seemed at odds with how your system, as described by Frankie, was going to work.

Raider has now come along and stated there will be a ban list, being caught once will mean the ability to play again being removed permanently, and as such fits much more closely with how server and league admins work.

I've read most of the 50 pages of this thread and until Raider posted I was beginning to think you guys had missed the point completely about what the community wants from an anti-cheat system, so please don't criticise the community for having a dig when it's taken 50 pages to get your point across.

[Shminkyboy]

It's ok, misunderstandings can be clarified. Without requiring 'digs' =)


I think I can speak for the team here in that we much prefer being informative and excited about upcoming releases, rather than confrontational about what we do. There are those in the community that know and respect this, but unfortunately some don't.

No offense, calling seti's response a criticism is a mis-characterisation; he was merely explaining his valid reason for not giving any more details about current development... I mean hell, he even admitted he misunderstood mistubishi's comment. So let's avoid accusations like that, shall we?



Thank you for your support =)

[FS Frankie V]

Ya talking about AC and cheaters is right up there with discussions of the religious or political nature.

The AC part of Passport is simply part of the service that it will offer where what we as a team talk about the most is the kinds of services Passport can offer as part of a network. In some ways focusing on just the AC part is rather disappointing as for the most part how much information the Passport team can give out is rather limited with out getting into areas that are sensitive.

Suggestions and services that Passport can supply is exciting, to me anyway, and can handle a lot of the requests and features that players have asked for in the past yet are difficult or imposable to implement directly in the game.

The opportunity being missed is adding ideas and suggestions of benefit to the players over and above a service that has been worked on now for two years based on what works and avoiding what does not.

Adding leader boards, individual stats, advance server browsers, server tracking, buddy lists, cross network communications, and even player notoriety and individual reward systems are possible as part of the service is a lot more exciting over and above an AC system that’s administrative in nature.

[DeMS]

s.e.t.i., on 10 July 2010 - 03:09 PM, said:

We give everything we read its due attention. I honestly don't care if anybody wants us to release code, there's only really one that I can think of that thinks we should... and that is the very least of our worries, trust me. However, I did not think that was what you meant and I'm not going to second guess or play games.

For reasons of protecting our intellectual property, we will NOT release any more information on the functionality of Passport or its relationship to the Anticheat that has been developed. This is for our own protection and ultimately YOURS [the community].

Completely agreed.

The less that gets released about the whole system, the harder it's going to be to bypass it - since it will involve more guessing and trial and error -, so the safer we all will be.

s.e.t.i., on 10 July 2010 - 03:09 PM, said:

I will say that we are very close to coming to an end of two long years of new development, bug fixes, maps and engine upgrades. So please sit tight for a just little while longer. Thanks :)

I just can't wait!

Thank you!

@ Frankie V :

While these parts of the Passport system are attractive, one major 'problem' of the latest releases was the lack of an official anti-cheat that would avoid the current state of cheat paranoia.

I agree that all those systems, menus and stats are going to be a huge improvement over what's already there, but having an anti-cheat program that works is fundamental for competitive play and the growth of the community.

I'm so wishing to hear again congratulations in the shape of 'nice shot m8' or 'clever move there dude' instead of being accused of using hacks when I try hard and succed at playing well.

My thought is that it will finally help to turn the toxic atmosphere that you can breath on some servers into the fresh air that comes from having it as 'granted' that the people you play against is going to be clean and willing to have fun/play/win.

That's why I'm so thanking s.e.t.i. and FrozenSand as a whole for that effort, and it's the same reason why I'm hoping they wait until everything anti-cheat related works flawlessly, as by itself this is one feature - understood from the point of the reaction that the community can have if it's flawed, the increase of cheat-induced paranoia and random accusing - that can make or break the great game UrbanTerror is.

To opinate on something that cannot be accessed isn't very wise, so I'm going to wait to see it working when it's released to comment and ask questions.

I sincerely hope you succeed on that next release and UrT goes up where it belongs.

[verme]

Hi all..

Im watching this topic for a long time and I want to know if there is some info about an release date?

For now, Im playng with UAC2 with matchID for all players but there is no way to lock the server and allow only UAC2 players in.

So, im waiting for this feature thatyou are working on and I realy want to see it in action.

any release dates in mind?


sorry about my english.