[BRAVO]

I found this (http://www.urbanterr...o/members/bans/) ban list in members section, i think it should be improved or removed from public free acces.

Quote

WARNING: These bans are not official, they are created by members and groups on their own servers. So, do not trust them without verification.

They are not official but they appear on the official Urban Terror webpage, and the list contains player names and IP. I think everyone will agree with me that there is a porcentage of server admins who ban players with not any reason or for wrong reasons.

Reasons to ban: (example: http://www.urbanterr...le/ripdep/bans/)

Reasons to ban on that list: Not wellcome (???); Lamer (what is he talking about?, as being lame can be understood in a lot of different ways), Obvious cheating (what do they call obvious and where can i see the demo?). It's just and example and those bans may be right (or not) in any case they are subjective and i should not have acces to it.

Myself am banned in not few server because of "obvious hacking" (???) and i never installed any cheat and i'm not even a good player compared to top tier. with the passage of time public ban list on official UrT website will end up being populated with things like this: http://www.mqcd.fr/banlist.php (people banned because of being 999, TK, being a pedophile (???), using a negev, and even worse..., hack acusation on players with out any trustable back up to make ban hack-accusation serious.

I would really hate to see my name one day in that list, and it will happen sooner or latter, same for a lot of other legit players..., and it will bring discomfort to a big part of community sooner or later.

That list can get to be useful, but to be useful only reason to be in it must be use of hacks, and the 100% of that people bans must be trustable (call it: not based on a one or more person subjective point of view if not official anticheat done my Frozen Sand when it released). Can be a really good thing that way, kind of (now inactive like) UAA but world wide scale, but as it is..., it's not only useless it's a way to defame players and in UrT official site without any trustable sustentation.

Hope you consider this
Regards.

EDIT: i found fonducci in the banlist (to be a lammer)!! http://www.urbanterr.../members/ban/5/

Muhahahhaa, i'll tell him 5 years legit UrT player now unfairly defamed on an urbanterror.info banlist by some noob..., you see what i'm talking about?

This post has been edited by BRAVO: 21 September 2012 - 01:23 AM

[Tranc3r]

That's actually a very valid point. There are tons of players with RCON on servers who get egomaniac and ban a player with more skill than them. I've been in many situations where I've been falsely banned for cheating. There are seriously some idiot admins out there.

[uJ|Driller]

I think this is a testing banpage, i see many FS guys banned, so i wont take the text seriously.
It looks like this wil be a list of permbans by FS, people who for whatever reason may not play this game anymore and are not allowed to register on this forum anymore.
Not sure, but this might be the Uber ban list (in beta shape)

[Drizzt]

BRAVO, on 21 September 2012 - 12:31 AM, said:

Reasons to ban: (example: http://www.urbanterr...le/ripdep/bans/)

Reasons to ban on that list: Not wellcome (???); Lamer (what is he talking about?, as being lame can be understood in a lot of different ways), Obvious cheating (what do they call obvious and where can i see the demo?). It's just and example and those bans may be right (or not) in any case they are subjective and i should not have acces to it.

What problem has about this banlist? (Yes, this banlist it's from my clan)
http://www.urbanterr...le/ripdep/bans/

Not wellcome and lammer bans, it's about some kid's don't respect other players, and other similar reasons (the ban it's not about player with high skill). And the ban of "obvious hacking", you can find the demo here http://www.urbanterr...members/ban/65/ on Reason and Message section.

[BRAVO]

Lately "It's a test" and "It's free" are being lame excuses for some things to be or to start being a way they should never been..., drama aside this is my personal opinion so respect it as what it is or gtfo.

Taken from the rules of the webpage of this people: http://www.urbanterr...rofile/bn/bans/ (draw your own conclusions)

Quote

1. If we do not like you, we can refuse to allow you to play on our servers.
3. If we feel you are cheating, even if we can't prove it, we can refuse to allow you to play on our servers.

Frozen Sand legitimizes things..., when i download a build, a server bot, or any kind of soft from this webpage i do it with the trust i'm not downloading any kind of malware, When there is a discussion about if some feature in a build should be considered cheating or not, the fact that the build has being published here legitimizes it, because i know FS will EVER let anyone to publish a cheat on their site.
Paying $6 a month for a server would allow you (for example) to run a neo-nazi UrT community (...) and to ban people on your server because of being black, jew, or stupid. And it's really good because..., they pay for the server and they can with it whatever they want, but will FS legitimate and adhere to it by publishing those bans in a list on their webpage? i hope not.

*Do i care on knowing the IP and account name of a french cheater cought on a french server by anticheat developed by Frozen Sand when released? Yesir i do.

*Do i care on knowing the IP or account name of a french who has been banned on a french server because another french feels his feeling have been wounded? hell no.

*Do i care on knowing the IP or account name of a "cheater" who is called cheater by "admins" like those i quoted up there? i give a flying *@!#..., they should learn to pley before calling hacks on people.

Then why not to turn that list from a beginning in a great tool it can be? giving public acces to it only to those benned by AC FS developed software when it released?.

Seriously, noob admins ruin Urban Terror potentially more that any blatant cheater around. Allow them to do their shit on servers they pay for..., but please.., do not give them that place here on urban terror official community.


Off-Topic:
@Drizzt: it's not my intention to turn this topic into a personal disscusion of any kind, please understand i'm talking in general therms and not about specifically you. Maybe all of bans in your list be well made bans and you are a great and fair admin, or maybe not..., the fact is that as admin of the server you pay for you have the freedom to ban any player for the reason you want, and it's all fine with it. But the fact that your "lammer" concept may be very different from mine and the fact you are not providing any kind of proof on those you call lammer, make that information irrelevant and useless for anyone except you and your clan/community, and it's out of place in a banlist supported by FS

This post has been edited by BRAVO: 21 September 2012 - 03:55 PM

[Tranc3r]

Drizzt, on 21 September 2012 - 02:45 PM, said:

What problem has about this banlist? (Yes, this banlist it's from my clan)
http://www.urbanterr...le/ripdep/bans/

Not wellcome and lammer bans, it's about some kid's don't respect other players, and other similar reasons (the ban it's not about player with high skill). And the ban of "obvious hacking", you can find the demo here http://www.urbanterr...members/ban/65/ on Reason and Message section.

I'm sure that if another server decides to use another group's banlist, they won't be checking every single 'cheater' ban to see if it's legit. If I was wrongly banned, it would be a real mess and a big hassle to communicate with 50 different servers based off a ban that one inexperienced admin made... Also, is there a way to know if you've been banned from a particular group's server, it would make the spreading of the false ban a lot less.

This post has been edited by Tranc3r: 22 September 2012 - 11:03 PM

[Drizzt]

Tranc3r, on 22 September 2012 - 10:59 PM, said:

I'm sure that if another server decides to use another group's banlist, they won't be checking every single 'cheater' ban to see if it's legit. If I was wrongly banned, it would be a real mess and a big hassle to communicate with 50 different servers based off a ban that one inexperienced admin made... Also, is there a way to know if you've been banned from a particular group's server, it would make the spreading of the false ban a lot less.

Each server, can choose which ban list subscribe and which level. If i subscribe a ban list the Clan Base with level cheat, the cheaters, and obvius cheater has been banned too from my server.

My clan ban list it's subscribe to well know's ban list (Clan Base, Urban Zone, UAA and FS) with level cheater and this ban list, ban players with a good reason.

I'm pretty sure the admin's of servers, don't subscribe to all ban list. In the 4.1 very servers download the ban list of UAA, it's the same but with much organization.

I don't know if it's possible see if a player has been banned in his profile (other players), maybe only can in his own profile.

[Tranc3r]

Drizzt, on 23 September 2012 - 11:58 AM, said:

Each server, can choose which ban list subscribe and which level. If i subscribe a ban list the Clan Base with level cheat, the cheaters, and obvius cheater has been banned too from my server.

My clan ban list it's subscribe to well know's ban list (Clan Base, Urban Zone, UAA and FS) with level cheater and this ban list, ban players with a good reason.

I'm pretty sure the admin's of servers, don't subscribe to all ban list. In the 4.1 very servers download the ban list of UAA, it's the same but with much organization.

I don't know if it's possible see if a player has been banned in his profile (other players), maybe only can in his own profile.

I just hope that when a ban gets lifted from server X, it updates the banlist of the other servers that are using server X's list.

[BRAVO]

I think you are loosing the main point of this.

1- Lets suppose i'm a neo-nazi guy with an UrT server, and i start banning people because "being a fuking jew", I would be braking more than a couple FS website terms of service but that is what will appear on FS website banlist.., so will FS spend resourses on a babysitter job telling server admins how they must manage their servers? will server admins lose their freedom to manage their server in the way they like (even if they are lame)?.

2- Main banlist can be a really powerful tool, but to be a powerful tool bans on it must be 100% cheaters and 100% done without human subjectivity (Anticheat developed by FS when released).

[Tranc3r]

Well.. I think each group has its own rule of what to call cheater, etc... I see your concern clearly, but the statement made by FS "WARNING: This ban is not official. So, do not trust it without verification." allows them to not investigate the issue and indicates that admins that are using other's banlist are using it at their own risk. I believe the anti-cheat will be for HD and the whole banlist will just be automatic where only cheaters caught by the detector will be banned from all authenticated-only-play servers.