[24/7.x3r]

Lets face it, the minimap is really bad for seeing where you are in relation to the rest of your team.

So I have a suggestion that there be a cg_ToggleTeamVisible [1/0] (also maybe enabled /disabled from server as well?)

This would place symbols above players in your team and make these symbols visible through walls, this allows you to see exactly where your team is in relation to yourself. (this would also make the medic symbol that is already in use, be seen through walls).

Although it may be too hard to implement or ruin game play, where in that case.. we need a rotating minimap or radar, based on where the player is looking.

[SilverFoxZ]

F2, Communicate with your team. Problem solved.

And i think the minimap is fine once you know the map you can tell in what position your teammate is most of the time.

Maybe polish it little more so you can see the buildings etc. better but i dont see the point of having a rotating radar map, it shows you less than the current one.

[24/7.x3r]

Communicating with my team would not be a problem if anyone in pubs used VoIP, but they do not.

I have to check the minimap before I can throw a grenade on maps like dust2, which takes a very long time. By the time I check the minimap, the opportunity to nade is over.

I could make the minimap very big, then I would be able to see quickly, but I wouldn't be able to see much in the actual game and the arrows are distracting.

Some people play a fast and aggressive game, moving at the right times to catch the enemy off guard and if they do not know where their team is (without taking 5seconds to discipher the minimap) it makes it a lot harder to plan movements that compliment the team.

I will try configure my minimap in a way I can read it fast, but I doubt I will be able to.

EDIT: If this was to happen or a rotating map they would not replace the current minimap, it would be an option since people want both options.

This post has been edited by x3r: 05 January 2013 - 03:57 PM

[24/7.x3r]

Sorry for a double post.

I would like to say that I am just putting my ideas out there for everyone to see, so others can build on them and related ideas can be pinged around.

I know rotating minimaps has been discussed before and some people do not like the idea.

Although the idea of team player symbols that can be seen by other people on the team comes from a completely different angle on the issue.

I think it should be given some thought before it gets shot down.

[MajkiFajki]

Lol @ server message in top left corner.

Problem with that kind of idea is kinda simple - you can get easily eye-gauged. Many moving glowing symbols on screen can be very distracting.

But dunno - let the community discuss it.

[n1n]

i honestly dislike the idea to make urt to be "like any other game" and it is really sad to see new games treating players like disabled retards who have no clue where their teammates are, so that the system has to literally wallhack for them.
it's sad, it's stupid, it is not teaching anything, nor teamwork, nor predicting what your teammates will do.
probably the last thing i'd want to see in UrT.

[FSK405|Reflux]

n1n, on 05 January 2013 - 06:58 PM, said:

i honestly dislike the idea to make urt to be "like any other game" and it is really sad to see new games treating players like disabled retards who have no clue where their teammates are, so that the system has to literally wallhack for them.
it's sad, it's stupid, it is not teaching anything, nor teamwork, nor predicting what your teammates will do.
probably the last thing i'd want to see in UrT.

Urt is teaching me something? The mini-map is just about useless in so many maps. It doesn't rotate, so it takes longer to gain your bearings and realize where your teammates are in relation to yourself that by the time you want to react to an event, it is over and you're dead. The response is, "fug it, tk if I have to." The arrow sizes are not consistent, EVER. You get these huge arrows that overlap on this tiny map. Yah, it's the problem of map makers not giving enough attention to that kind of detail, but as players...we're screwed. Some maps don't even have a mini-map...tarded.

What Urt is teaching us is that those other games that teach us how to be disabled retards are becoming more fun to play because we have methods by which we can communicate with players not using VoIP. We're busy adding a 9mm Glock 18C that is labeled Glock 19 and sports a .45 cal suppressor, while the request for an option to have a rotating mini-map has been ignored for years, while hit detection is curiously still not hitting, while no-stamina was only added to jump mode.

The reality is this: I, the actor in the game, possess the technology to see player name and health over the player model. I have this magical device (mini-map) that tells me where my teammates are in the map. But technology fails me to bring those two features together and locate the player name and health cast through solid objects. You want to refer to me as a disabled retard and the feature "wall-hacking".

The reduced reality is what had kept Urt fun, I don't see anybody asking to change that.

[s.e.t.i.]

I personally hate rotating minimaps, but that is a personal opinion and not the official standing of FS.

I have never had problem knowing who is who on my team on the map via communications by the team. As somebody who works with leagues in certain regards, I see plenty of teams who have implemented textual location/direction keybinds to keep their team informed.Part of the competitive nature of this game is embedded in good communications, people learn to use the tools provided in the game. Any team with talent will know who is who on the minimap because they have practiced their routes and have their positions assigned. It adds complexity and challenge to the game. This has very little bearing in a pub server that plays mostly unfinished 3rd party maps like FSK405, so please be careful calling out the "tards". Mapmakers are responsible for their maps and that includes minimaps.


I personally love the archaic HUD in Urt. It's simple and I'm very used to it, as are most who play this.

[GlaD-don]

x3r, on 05 January 2013 - 03:40 PM, said:

Communicating with my team would not be a problem if anyone in pubs used VoIP, but they do not.

And seeing your teammates through walls will improve teamwork how?

--

Rotating minimap is a good idea imo. I find a few maps' minimaps difficult to orient myself with due to the fact the minimap is generated based on the xy plane, but mappers can build the flow of their map east/west or north/south. So you end up with some maps where the flags are north/south and others east/west, and some of the maps have the red flag in the north, others in the south, etc. No consistency and it sometimes is confusing when the flags aren't displayed.

Now, with a rotating map, 0 degrees (where your xhair is) in your pov is always fixed as the top center of the minimap. You're aimed at the enemy's flag? Their flag is ALWAYS to the north. VERY easy to figure out your teammates' positions. idk if it's just me who sometimes gets lost staring at a minimap with flags not in their default locations, but it does happen every so often, and I feel like it's due to something inherently wrong with how the minimap is being displayed to me.

I know all the common maps like the back of my hand, and I want the minimap to be reflective of how I am using that knowledge, not a static blueprint of the level. I would like the map to just display teammate positions because I don't need to rely on the map as a navigational aid. A rotating minimap is, imo, harder to use as a "GPS," but much more useful if you are wanting to establish relative positioning of your teammates. Probably not doing a good job explaining this, but it's also something I've never really thought about until now.



I should admit I never look at the map in pubs and only glance at it every 30 s or so in matches with voip. It's just not a terribly useful thing even if you make it more readily readable. But here's the thing: it should not be a radar/wallhack! The difficulty inherent in establishing teammate positioning and coordination is a very important part of gameplay. You can't take that away and still have the game fun. You know why most of us don't hack? Because it ruins the fun. It makes it too easy. Now, it's important to differentiate between a challenge and an artificial handicap. I'm sure we've all played Nintendo games, and remember games with bad controls that needed precise timing and actions (if you don't, google AVGN and watch). The precise timing is a challenge. You need skill. The sloppy controls are the artificial handicap that makes the game "harder" to complete. You can't plan around it because it's unreliable. This is not a perfect analogy to the minimap situation, but I feel like I can reconcile my argument for leaving the minimap mostly alone, but creating an option to allow it to rotate, with the notion of real challenge and artificial challenge/handicap. Some may not agree, but w/e:P


long post, bleh.

This post has been edited by don: 05 January 2013 - 08:47 PM

[FS Frankie V]

Isn’t seeing players through a wall considered cheating?