[Lecter2142]

First before I go on I just have a question: are we going to be able to use the current maps on UrT HD? All these pk3 custom maps... Could we use them on the next version? I hope so otherwise you're giving up too much content away and it will be like starting from scratch which is not cool.


So now my thread's point: please do not repeat the same mistakes on UrT HD.

You're a mapper: you create half of the game's environment and your map will define the way people will play this game. So be careful about what you're going to do because here are the mistakes they have done and these mistakes are partly responsible for the standing of this game and the standing of the players' play today...

• Please, make sure your map's elements have a decent size. Make huge doors, don't overload them with details that will just stop us from moving ourselves when we play. The amount of blocks we get on Turnpike with the doors is just insane. the hallways in sanctuary are damn too small as well. Okay maybe the hallways can be small. But make sure we don't block ourselves in the entrances. It's just so frustrating to get blocked because a space of my screen as large as my hair doesn't get into it.
  
• Don't make frozen-constipated-style maps. Team Survivor is ruined nowadays because everyone camps. Why? Because the maps allow people to do so. Please don't abuse with all the corners and little tricky useless spots.
  
• A map used in leagues is meant to be played, not to be watched. Some maps played in leagues are just over abusing the CPU resources of computers such as mine because there's too much emphasis put on graphics and details. Sure you can make nice maps and extend your creativity but think about those who will play it. A good example is Casa. The music is useless, too many graphic details that make people lag and stop them from being able to move or play decently. Red room on orbital made people lag back in its beginning because of the red light or something. Tohunga is actually the best example I can give. Too many details that consume the computer's CPU and stop people from playing. It's stupid but it plays a big role there. Please make sure you optimize your maps for leagues.

It's all I have to say for now. Some maps make TS mode unplayable because people either camp way too much or just play poorly. Make a fast, playable, and dynamic map for leagues.

Cheers.

[FS Frankie V]

Nope current maps will not work under the UE4 engine.

3rd party map makers will still be able to make maps. The may available in the current package was supplied by 3rd party and many of the maps used in competition is made by them.

[FS Barbatos]

Lecter2142, on 05 July 2014 - 04:15 AM, said:

First before I go on I just have a question: are we going to be able to use the current maps on UrT HD? All these pk3 custom maps... Could we use them on the next version? I hope so otherwise you're giving up too much content away and it will be like starting from scratch which is not cool.

Hey Brainie, it's like asking if you can use your Super Nintendo game on a Playstation 4 first try. No you can't, but you can convert your map to make it work with little effort. I'm sure Frankie will come with a nice tutorial someday. :)

[Kolossus]

Lecter2142, on 05 July 2014 - 04:15 AM, said:

[list]
Please, make sure your map's elements have a decent size. Make huge doors, don't overload them with details that will just stop us from moving ourselves when we play. The amount of blocks we get on Turnpike with the doors is just insane. the hallways in sanctuary are damn too small as well. Okay maybe the hallways can be small. But make sure we don't block ourselves in the entrances. It's just so frustrating to get blocked because a space of my screen as large as my hair doesn't get into it.

I usually get stuck in TP's doors because too many players rush at once, but the problem might be the doors themselves and not the door frame.

Lecter2142, on 05 July 2014 - 04:15 AM, said:

Don't make frozen-constipated-style maps. Team Survivor is ruined nowadays because everyone camps. Why? Because the maps allow people to do so. Please don't abuse with all the corners and little tricky useless spots.

The problem/cause of campers is not the corners in a map, it's the campers. There are many corners but I know many players, me included, that don't camp, even with 1 health. So make sure the server has present admins at most times and you won't have campers. Sorry but I disagree that the problem is the maps, it's the behavior.

Lecter2142, on 05 July 2014 - 04:15 AM, said:

A good example is Casa. The music is useless

I agree that too much detail on a map is not needed (unfortunately we cannot add too much), but the music in Casa is iconic for me. I mean, it's one of the few things I still remember from my first games on UrT, the music in Casa. And also the "Blue/Red team wins!" voice. :P

This post has been edited by Kolossus: 05 July 2014 - 09:26 AM

[strayA#Pez]

Lecter2142, on 05 July 2014 - 04:15 AM, said:

Campers

Make maps for bomb mode, having an objective will stop people from sitting back and baiting the other team. The maps need open bombsites so those that are defending cannot hide in corners and 'camp'.

[rastablaster]

Defending in BM is about smart "camping". Get over it.

[strayA#Pez]

rastablaster, on 14 July 2014 - 07:05 AM, said:

Defending in BM is about smart "camping". Get over it.

I wasn't complaining about camping in Bomb mode, i am more than aware that it is part of defending. Merely providing a solution to the OP's problem of campers in TS. A Round objective will force the teams to actually play.

[N.t.H.]

As I recall the map design in UE in general is about assets being placed on the map, am I right? Back in UrT the maps consisted of only a few meshes.

(I'm asking because I started to do a redesign of Algiers for a potential UrT Hd once... but never finished it because I modelled it in Blender and had problems porting it into the radiant. With UE it's much easier :) )

Also, what level of detail are you aiming at, model- and texture-wise?

[FS Frankie V]

UE4 is whats called a closed edit environment that favors modular map designs. With strong FBX support skills in 3d editing packages will become important to the addition of detailed mesh based models. Sounds rather aggressive as to adding detail to a map that one would think would hinder performance but is a smart way to go as you can create LOD versions of a high detail model as well as instancing of common elements.

A copy of a tree for example is equal to one tree if the many that you make as a copy are used as well. Same with windows so if you have a thousand high detail window models, with LODs, then the memory foot print is equal to a single window. Also models that are not with in the visual rage of the view port will be culled, excluded, from being rendered so the overall performance envelope is far superior even compared to low detail maps in 4.2/idtech3

As for how much detail will be coming for HD that’s to be seen as there is room and use for both high and low detail maps in the world of UrT

[N.t.H.]

Thanks for the answers! Just recently discovered that you've got a youtube channel, too, where you give some insight into your developement :)

As for the custom maps: Are there any problems with 3rd party mappers restoring/recreating older UrT maps? I believe I remember that there was at least one problem (copyright?) which (for example) hindered you from copying Turnpike 1:1. Instead you've made Nevada using the Turnpike layout.
Would be good to know before mappers start getting serious with facelifting old UrT-maps :D