[<AnonDafb]

Whats are the properties of your PC, because I can compile any map and is fast, the maximum maybe is 15 min, but no more!

[ds`killspree]

AnonDafb, on 24 January 2015 - 05:20 AM, said:

Whats are the properties of your PC, because I can compile any map and is fast, the maximum maybe is 15 min, but no more!

haha yes i know right Like i said before i was using the build in bsp (final Urt) compile it seemed to take ages with passageportalflow.

Thanks to you now im using the q3map2build and compiling takes 10 min like you said so thanks bro for the nice tutorial.

[<AnonDafb]

killspree, on 24 January 2015 - 06:59 AM, said:

haha yes i know right Like i said before i was using the build in bsp (final Urt) compile it seemed to take ages with passageportalflow.

Thanks to you now im using the q3map2build and compiling takes 10 min like you said so thanks bro for the nice tutorial.

You can too decompile the .bsp to .map with the q3map2build...

[Mod [dswp]JRandomNoob]

So everything’s fine now?

Most of the map, as you said, is indeed detail; however, this also means that the hints are completely useless.

Quake culling (deciding which surfaces and entities to draw and which not at any given moment) works by splitting the map space along the surfaces of structural brushes and then computing a visibility list for each of those blocks (“nodes”). If another node is visible (for the engine, not necessarily for the player) from the node you’re in, everything in it and touching it will be drawn. Quake 3 hints work by splitting the BSP further than structural brushes alone would, thus reducing the amount of space seen from nearby nodes, but this requires vis blocking to work — i.e. structural brushes. All your large features should be structural without gaps (otherwise the vis process can “see” right through them, even if you can’t) and if your map has some prominent half-height features (like yours does) a horizontal hint that touches or cuts the top of the lowest one can be useful. (Lowest one as in, at least taller than the players.)

Well-made maps are usually designed as shells around corridors rather than a bunch of boxes in a larger box. Building walls as hollow shells also makes it much easier to change the architecture because you don’t have to worry about what’s happening in the other end of the building if you move this brush or that one.

Nib’s World (Wayback Machine copy has a detail/structural and hint tutorial I found useful when I started mapping.

[ds`killspree]

JRandomNoob, on 24 January 2015 - 01:31 PM, said:

So everything’s fine now?

Most of the map, as you said, is indeed detail; however, this also means that the hints are completely useless.

Quake culling (deciding which surfaces and entities to draw and which not at any given moment) works by splitting the map space along the surfaces of structural brushes and then computing a visibility list for each of those blocks (“nodes”). If another node is visible (for the engine, not necessarily for the player) from the node you’re in, everything in it and touching it will be drawn. Quake 3 hints work by splitting the BSP further than structural brushes alone would, thus reducing the amount of space seen from nearby nodes, but this requires vis blocking to work — i.e. structural brushes. All your large features should be structural without gaps (otherwise the vis process can “see” right through them, even if you can’t) and if your map has some prominent half-height features (like yours does) a horizontal hint that touches or cuts the top of the lowest one can be useful. (Lowest one as in, at least taller than the players.)

Well-made maps are usually designed as shells around corridors rather than a bunch of boxes in a larger box. Building walls as hollow shells also makes it much easier to change the architecture because you don’t have to worry about what’s happening in the other end of the building if you move this brush or that one.

Nib’s World (Wayback Machine copy has a detail/structural and hint tutorial I found useful when I started mapping.

Yes after i got the q3map2build working my compile takes 10-15 min.
Ok I will go into it and try to make some sense and i know you are right in my opinion the map is already way to cluttered, so you mean to say its better to have a hollow box instead of drawing a large 3d box for a building ?
And so i dont remember who again but they where wrong to tell me i should make everything detail except the outer hull now my map has far to many splits prob.?
BTW the reason i made everything detail was because i got a error while compiling max tw verts 12 exceeded is there an way to take out those brushes?

This post has been edited by killspree: 24 January 2015 - 09:23 PM

[Mod [dswp]JRandomNoob]

Here, that’s what I’m talking about:



“ERROR: MAX_TW_VERTS exceeded” happens when you have one or more overly complex (structural) brushes in your map, and you indeed do have quite a few, like those light domes and drainpipes. When you fix this problem you may get “ERROR: MAX_MAP_VISIBILITY exceeded” which means that there’s still too many small structural brushes (look at those pallets, omgwtfbbq) creating a huge number of nodes and at least one of those can see way too many other nodes.

[ds`killspree]

JRandomNoob, on 24 January 2015 - 10:31 PM, said:

Here, that’s what I’m talking about:



“ERROR: MAX_TW_VERTS exceeded” happens when you have one or more overly complex (structural) brushes in your map, and you indeed do have quite a few, like those light domes and drainpipes. When you fix this problem you may get “ERROR: MAX_MAP_VISIBILITY exceeded” which means that there’s still too many small structural brushes (look at those pallets, omgwtfbbq) creating a huge number of nodes and at least one of those can see way too many other nodes.

ok im taking your advice to notice and reworking the map i started with the outer hull then to the outer most building making sure they are structural if i move forward in this fashion and making all smaller brushes like the pallets and those lightpoles and draipipes detailed will it be better?

hull.map

This post has been edited by killspree: 25 January 2015 - 06:17 AM

[Mod [dswp]JRandomNoob]

Yes. All large blocky features structural, all small and/or complex ones detail. Stuff that’s large enough to block line of sight completely, that you can’t just jump over or step around should be structural to stop unneeded surfaces from being drawn. Take a look at my very own first map, Tharsia KO (the .map file is in the PK3) — flying around and through walls, toggling detail on and off should give you a pretty good idea of the logic there.

[ds`killspree]

JRandomNoob, on 25 January 2015 - 04:21 PM, said:

Yes. All large blocky features structural, all small and/or complex ones detail. Stuff that’s large enough to block line of sight completely, that you can’t just jump over or step around should be structural to stop unneeded surfaces from being drawn. Take a look at my very own first map, Tharsia KO (the .map file is in the PK3) — flying around and through walls, toggling detail on and off should give you a pretty good idea of the logic there.

First of of that a cool map i like it im thinking of putting it in our mapcycle,
i'm goin to try to get everything up to spec im my map also i know im very noobish so this pro advice is apriciated :D thanks

[=IvN=ottone]

I checked hull.map and i see an inappropriate use of structural brushes;

here some screenshot from my map that can help/inspire you to make a map with a correct use of detail/structural brushes:

external structural brush:

internal structural brush:

detail brush:

external skybox area:

internal skybox area: